San Merah?
San Merah?
Been out of the hobby for a bit, just got back into it and I'm curious - are San Merah still being bred? Had a gorgeous pair years ago from Discus USA, not sure if he's still in business. Anyone know of a reputable breeder who's got some? Still one of my all-time favorites.
Re: San Merah?
I haven't come across San Merah for sale recently, it seems like most breeders are focusing on other varieties, with Red Cover discus being one of the more common ones I've seen.
Re: San Merah?
Re: San Merah?
You might want to check this out: Discus Madness has San Merah available - they're known for their quality stock.
You might want to check this out: Discus Madness has San Merah available - they're known for their quality stock.
Re: San Merah?
Re: San Merah?
Originally posted by Luckyo
Check out this link for San Merah - https://www.discusmadness.com/product/san-merah/. What caught my eye is that the San Merah on this site doesn't show any stress bars.
Originally posted by Luckyo
Check out this link for San Merah - https://www.discusmadness.com/product/san-merah/. What caught my eye is that the San Merah on this site doesn't show any stress bars.
Re: San Merah?
Re: San Merah?
Thanks for the lead, Luckyo. For the OP, it seems the definition of San Merah might be a bit flexible. I had some a while back from Kenny, but the details are fuzzy - I think they had a solid brown base with a red cover, but don't quote me on that. Maybe Luckyo can shed some light, but I believe these fish came from specific parent lines, which might be worth looking into.
Thanks for the lead, Luckyo. For the OP, it seems the definition of San Merah might be a bit flexible. I had some a while back from Kenny, but the details are fuzzy - I think they had a solid brown base with a red cover, but don't quote me on that. Maybe Luckyo can shed some light, but I believe these fish came from specific parent lines, which might be worth looking into.
Re: San Merah?
Re: San Merah?
No stress bars, that's true. I've seen some in the past, though, with just eyebars - not strictly San Merahs, I know, but man, I love the look. True SMs are a rare sight these days, it's all just "the name" now.
No stress bars, that's true. I've seen some in the past, though, with just eyebars - not strictly San Merahs, I know, but man, I love the look. True SMs are a rare sight these days, it's all just "the name" now.
Re: San Merah?
Re: San Merah?
I've been reading up on the history of the San Merah Discus in a great reference book, 'Singapore Discus In The New Millennium' by Dr. Cillford Chan and Johnny Yip. The story of how the San Merah came to be is quite fascinating.
It all started with the Ghost Discus, which Asian producers found to be a game-changer due to its solid, flat color and lack of bars. To create a more intense red color, they crossed the 'Virgin Red Discus' with the Ghost Red Discus. However, the Virgin Red Discus had its own set of issues, mainly the abundance of black pigments that prevented it from achieving a vibrant red color.
To overcome this, producers took two different approaches. Some crossed the F2s of the wild Green Discus with the Virgin Red, resulting in the 'Rose Red Discus'. Others, like Hai Khoon Tan from Singapore, crossed the F2s of the wild Browns with the Virgin Red. Tan's efforts led to the creation of the 'San Merah', which was later renamed 'Red Cover' after he parted ways with his business partner, See Cheow San.
Interestingly, the San Merah and Red Cover are essentially the same fish. The quest for a better quality red discus continued, with producers experimenting with different crosses. One notable example is the 'Red Passion', created by Ivan Seah by crossing the Golden Sunrise with the San Merah.
Other notable mentions include the 'Red Melon', a result of crossing the Rose Red Discus with the F1s obtained from the Golden Discus and Marlboro Red Discus, and the 'Tangerine Discus', which came from crossing the Virgin Red with the Golden Discus.
These experiments demonstrate how the Ghost Discus mutation played a crucial role in producing a solid, flat-colored red discus. I hope this information serves as a guide for producers and answers some questions about the various red discus varieties.
PS
In loving memory of Tan Hai Khoon, a legend in the Singapore discus community, who left us on 09-03-2016 but will always be remembered.
I've been reading up on the history of the San Merah Discus in a great reference book, 'Singapore Discus In The New Millennium' by Dr. Cillford Chan and Johnny Yip. The story of how the San Merah came to be is quite fascinating.
It all started with the Ghost Discus, which Asian producers found to be a game-changer due to its solid, flat color and lack of bars. To create a more intense red color, they crossed the 'Virgin Red Discus' with the Ghost Red Discus. However, the Virgin Red Discus had its own set of issues, mainly the abundance of black pigments that prevented it from achieving a vibrant red color.
To overcome this, producers took two different approaches. Some crossed the F2s of the wild Green Discus with the Virgin Red, resulting in the 'Rose Red Discus'. Others, like Hai Khoon Tan from Singapore, crossed the F2s of the wild Browns with the Virgin Red. Tan's efforts led to the creation of the 'San Merah', which was later renamed 'Red Cover' after he parted ways with his business partner, See Cheow San.
Interestingly, the San Merah and Red Cover are essentially the same fish. The quest for a better quality red discus continued, with producers experimenting with different crosses. One notable example is the 'Red Passion', created by Ivan Seah by crossing the Golden Sunrise with the San Merah.
Other notable mentions include the 'Red Melon', a result of crossing the Rose Red Discus with the F1s obtained from the Golden Discus and Marlboro Red Discus, and the 'Tangerine Discus', which came from crossing the Virgin Red with the Golden Discus.
These experiments demonstrate how the Ghost Discus mutation played a crucial role in producing a solid, flat-colored red discus. I hope this information serves as a guide for producers and answers some questions about the various red discus varieties.
PS
In loving memory of Tan Hai Khoon, a legend in the Singapore discus community, who left us on 09-03-2016 but will always be remembered.
Re: San Merah?
Re: San Merah?
Originally posted by basis
No stress bars, but I've come across some in the past with only eyebars - they don't qualify as true San Merahs, but I absolutely love the look. True San Merahs are hardly seen anymore; it's just the name being used now.
I've seen several sellers and breeders claiming to sell San Merahs, including some with great reputations, but they're often just selling Rose Reds or Virgin Reds with bars, or Red Covers with a single eye bar. The name has become a marketing tool to charge more money. As Cliff and others have pointed out, a real San Merah has no bars at all.
Armando picked up some Red Covers a few years ago, and two of them appeared to be barless. Unfortunately, he disappeared before we could see if they matured into something that could almost be considered a San Merah.
Originally posted by basis
No stress bars, but I've come across some in the past with only eyebars - they don't qualify as true San Merahs, but I absolutely love the look. True San Merahs are hardly seen anymore; it's just the name being used now.
I've seen several sellers and breeders claiming to sell San Merahs, including some with great reputations, but they're often just selling Rose Reds or Virgin Reds with bars, or Red Covers with a single eye bar. The name has become a marketing tool to charge more money. As Cliff and others have pointed out, a real San Merah has no bars at all.
Armando picked up some Red Covers a few years ago, and two of them appeared to be barless. Unfortunately, he disappeared before we could see if they matured into something that could almost be considered a San Merah.
Re: San Merah?
Re: San Merah?
Thanks for all the insight on San Merahs, everyone. I'm with basis - sometimes I don't mind stress bars if the deep brown color's there. It's probably a long shot finding genuine San Merahs these days, though. Good to see Cliff's still around, he was a huge help when I was struggling with artificial fry raising a few years back. He even assisted me with a pair of "San Merahs" and their babies - I still kick myself for selling those fish.
Thanks for all the insight on San Merahs, everyone. I'm with basis - sometimes I don't mind stress bars if the deep brown color's there. It's probably a long shot finding genuine San Merahs these days, though. Good to see Cliff's still around, he was a huge help when I was struggling with artificial fry raising a few years back. He even assisted me with a pair of "San Merahs" and their babies - I still kick myself for selling those fish.