Problem
1. I've got a discus with some issues and I'm hoping to get some insight. The blue male discus in the picture has some white scratches on its scales. I'm wondering if these could be from recent battles with other males or maybe even from the wood in the tank. This is the only fish with a problem and it just started showing up recently.
2. The symptoms I've observed are white scratches on the scales as seen in the picture.
3. I haven't tried any medications or treatments yet, so I'm looking for advice on where to start.
Tank/Water
4. My tank is a 150 gal with a 50 gal sump and refugium.
5. I do 30% water changes every 5-7 days.
6. The tank has been running since 2018. It's a planted tank with a mix of plant soil and sand substrate.
7. I age 90% of my water, which is RO/DI H2O. The remaining 10% is top water that's been dechlorinated but not aged. I keep the pH swing under two tenths of a percent.
8. I use SeaChem Prime concentrate as my water conditioner. I add it to the tank.
9. Here are my water parameters:
- temp 82° F
- pH 6.6
- ammonia 0 ppm
- nitrite 0 ppm
- nitrate under 10 ppm
I use a mix of 10% municipal water and 90% RO water. I also supplement with Seachem Discus Trace Elements after water changes.
10. No new fish, plants, or inverts have been added recently.
11. I feed my fish a homemade beef heart and seafood mix, supplemented with spinach, kelp seaweed, and other trace elements based on breeder recipes. I feed them every morning. I also give them multiple feedings of live white worms that I've cultured, as well as black worms from Eastern Aquatics.
12. I've attached a picture of the affected fish.
Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
That discus looks like it got wedged somewhere and got scratched up trying to wriggle free.
I'm curious about your test kit - is it still good to use? With the food you're giving them and how often you're feeding, I just can't see how you're keeping those nitrates under 10 ppm with a 30% weekly water change. Let's do the math - you start with 10 ppm, change 30% of the water, and you're down to 7 ppm. But then they go up 1.5 ppm a day, so by the next water change, you're back up to 17 ppm. Without a massive water change, those nitrates just keep climbing.
So either your test kit is past its expiration date, or something's not adding up.
That discus looks like it got wedged somewhere and got scratched up trying to wriggle free.
I'm curious about your test kit - is it still good to use? With the food you're giving them and how often you're feeding, I just can't see how you're keeping those nitrates under 10 ppm with a 30% weekly water change. Let's do the math - you start with 10 ppm, change 30% of the water, and you're down to 7 ppm. But then they go up 1.5 ppm a day, so by the next water change, you're back up to 17 ppm. Without a massive water change, those nitrates just keep climbing.
So either your test kit is past its expiration date, or something's not adding up.
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Actually, I do 90% water changes weekly or 30% every 2 days, not 30% every 5-7 days. I've been considering the possibility of White Cotton Slime Stains, but I'm not entirely convinced. Deepsea mentioned the fish might have gotten stuck behind something and was damaged wiggling out, which could be a plausible explanation. However, I'm still unsure. Given the situation, would you recommend quarantining and treating the fish at this point?
Actually, I do 90% water changes weekly or 30% every 2 days, not 30% every 5-7 days. I've been considering the possibility of White Cotton Slime Stains, but I'm not entirely convinced. Deepsea mentioned the fish might have gotten stuck behind something and was damaged wiggling out, which could be a plausible explanation. However, I'm still unsure. Given the situation, would you recommend quarantining and treating the fish at this point?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Alright, I'm with you now, those numbers make more sense. I've never come across an aquarium disease called White Cotton Slime Stains - sounds a bit suspect to me. Those marks look more like the fish got stuck behind something and managed to wriggle free. The fact they just showed up out of the blue points to an injury, if you ask me.
Considering your tank's setup, I'd be inclined to add a bit of salt - three tablespoons per 10 gallons should do the trick. Not sure how it'll interact with your plants, but it's worth a shot to prevent any bacterial infections taking advantage of those open scratches. Never used Stress Coat myself, but it might be worth looking into, see if it helps.
Alright, I'm with you now, those numbers make more sense. I've never come across an aquarium disease called White Cotton Slime Stains - sounds a bit suspect to me. Those marks look more like the fish got stuck behind something and managed to wriggle free. The fact they just showed up out of the blue points to an injury, if you ask me.
Considering your tank's setup, I'd be inclined to add a bit of salt - three tablespoons per 10 gallons should do the trick. Not sure how it'll interact with your plants, but it's worth a shot to prevent any bacterial infections taking advantage of those open scratches. Never used Stress Coat myself, but it might be worth looking into, see if it helps.
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Salt in my show tank is a no-go - it'd kill all my plants. I've dealt with White Cotton before, it's a fungal infection. Typically, I treat with tetracycline in a hospital tank or bucket.
I do have multiple stumps in the tank that could've caused the scratches, but it seems a bit excessive. I'm looking for input from others with experience in discus fungal infections - should I treat immediately or just keep an eye on him for now?
Salt in my show tank is a no-go - it'd kill all my plants. I've dealt with White Cotton before, it's a fungal infection. Typically, I treat with tetracycline in a hospital tank or bucket.
I do have multiple stumps in the tank that could've caused the scratches, but it seems a bit excessive. I'm looking for input from others with experience in discus fungal infections - should I treat immediately or just keep an eye on him for now?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
I'm inclined to agree with Deepsea's assessment. The appearance of the scratches suggests the fish may have gotten wedged somewhere and struggled to free itself. It's also possible that the fish got startled and collided with a decoration.
In my experience, after a scrape like this, you might notice a white, cotton-like substance forming around the scratches within a day or two. This is likely the slime coat working to cover the wound and facilitate healing. You might even notice some bubbles. After about a week or two, the white should dissipate, and the scales should start to regrow.
I think the recommendation for salt is a good one, as it can help prevent bacterial infection from taking hold in the open wounds. However, I understand your concern about the potential impact on your plants. The suggested concentration should be low enough not to cause harm.
I'm inclined to agree with Deepsea's assessment. The appearance of the scratches suggests the fish may have gotten wedged somewhere and struggled to free itself. It's also possible that the fish got startled and collided with a decoration.
In my experience, after a scrape like this, you might notice a white, cotton-like substance forming around the scratches within a day or two. This is likely the slime coat working to cover the wound and facilitate healing. You might even notice some bubbles. After about a week or two, the white should dissipate, and the scales should start to regrow.
I think the recommendation for salt is a good one, as it can help prevent bacterial infection from taking hold in the open wounds. However, I understand your concern about the potential impact on your plants. The suggested concentration should be low enough not to cause harm.
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
I truly appreciate the insight you both have shared, it's like having the headlights turned back up after driving through a tunnel with severely dimmed visibility. I've been told that tonic salt for freshwater fish is similar to aspirin for humans - both have many beneficial uses, but shouldn't be administered routinely without a valid reason, which explains my initial hesitancy in my show tank, especially since I have a large community tank with some salt-sensitive species that I'm particularly fond of, like my pleco and cory catfish.
I'm considering heeding your advice by using salt dips in a hospital tank or a heated/aerated bucket for the affected discus, just for 2-3 hours. I want to emphasize that I respect both of your opinions and I'm not trying to be a know-it-all - I'm actually quite humble and aware that I don't have all the answers. My hesitation stems from not wanting to take any risks in my show/planted tank. Thankfully, only one of my discus is affected, and he's large enough to catch easily if I decide to go with the salt treatment. Maybe I'm being overly cautious, but as a discus enthusiast, I'm being a bit of a mother hen. Once again, I appreciate your thoughts and advice.
I truly appreciate the insight you both have shared, it's like having the headlights turned back up after driving through a tunnel with severely dimmed visibility. I've been told that tonic salt for freshwater fish is similar to aspirin for humans - both have many beneficial uses, but shouldn't be administered routinely without a valid reason, which explains my initial hesitancy in my show tank, especially since I have a large community tank with some salt-sensitive species that I'm particularly fond of, like my pleco and cory catfish.
I'm considering heeding your advice by using salt dips in a hospital tank or a heated/aerated bucket for the affected discus, just for 2-3 hours. I want to emphasize that I respect both of your opinions and I'm not trying to be a know-it-all - I'm actually quite humble and aware that I don't have all the answers. My hesitation stems from not wanting to take any risks in my show/planted tank. Thankfully, only one of my discus is affected, and he's large enough to catch easily if I decide to go with the salt treatment. Maybe I'm being overly cautious, but as a discus enthusiast, I'm being a bit of a mother hen. Once again, I appreciate your thoughts and advice.
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Hi raid, I think salt could be a good idea but have you considered trying a week of 50% or better water changes first? Clean water can work wonders in situations like this.
Hi raid, I think salt could be a good idea but have you considered trying a week of 50% or better water changes first? Clean water can work wonders in situations like this.
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
I'm on the same page with salt treatment. Considering the concerns about your show tank, a quarantine tank with salt would be the way to go. I'm curious, do you have a pleco in the tank? What other fish are you keeping with the discus?
I'm on the same page with salt treatment. Considering the concerns about your show tank, a quarantine tank with salt would be the way to go. I'm curious, do you have a pleco in the tank? What other fish are you keeping with the discus?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
Re: Scratches or fungal infection on skin of Blue?
I'm in agreement with the others on the salt treatment, but definitely in a QT tank, not the show tank. You've got a pretty diverse community going on, I'd love to know more about the other residents. What's the tank's inhabitants like?
I'm in agreement with the others on the salt treatment, but definitely in a QT tank, not the show tank. You've got a pretty diverse community going on, I'd love to know more about the other residents. What's the tank's inhabitants like?