Who Gives A Fish Forums

Hi everyone,

First time posting here, all the way from New Zealand.

I've been thinking about switching from my current sand substrate to Caribsea Eco-Complete. I've read some great reviews and I'm hoping it'll give my plants a boost. Despite using root tabs and liquid fertiliser, they're not doing well in the sand - their root systems are weak and I've read that this can happen because sand can be too compact and lacking in nutrients.

My main concern is my Cory - the Eco-Complete substrate isn't ideal for them on its own. I'm considering adding a layer of JBL Manado on top, about an inch deep. The round, light grains should be safe for my Cory to sift through, and it'll keep the red colour I'm after. In theory, being light, it should stay on top of the Eco-Complete without mixing or sinking - fingers crossed.

Any thoughts or suggestions? Am I on the right track or is there a better option I've missed?

Thanks.

I'm not convinced sand is the best option for my Cories, I've read that compacted sand can be tough on them. I'm thinking of using Caribsea Eco-Complete and topping it with JBL Manado, which should be safer for them as it's round and light.

As for lighting, I've got a 6500-9000K light, but my plants are still struggling. I'm wondering if the substrate is the main issue, rather than the light. I've heard that some plants just don't do well in sand, and that's what I'm experiencing.

I've got a group of Corydoras, and I'm aware that they have different water requirements. Mine are currently in a pH of 7.8-8.0, but I'm not sure if that's the best for them. I've been trying to minimize water disturbance to reduce stress, but I'm open to any suggestions on how to improve their environment.

Forget the Eco-Complete. It's too rough for corys, and any sand-like material on top will sift down naturally or get rooted through by the corys. I don't see any plant benefits from E-C or Flourite, a similar product.

I had Flourite in a 70g tank for two years, and I can tell you plant growth was no better than in my fine gravel and sand tanks. These products are too rough for substrate fish; I had to remove my corys due to mouth damage, but they recovered nicely over play sand.

I still needed to use substrate fertilizers with these enriched substrates, just like in my gravel and sand tanks. And liquid fertilizers too. Honestly, I saw no benefits, and considering the cost - $180 versus $14 for play sand - it wasn't worth it.

Your plants' root issues might be a nutrient deficiency. Liquid fertilizers are easy to add. We might be able to sort this out with more data on your setup - lighting, fertilizers, plant species.

Forget the Eco-Complete, it's too rough for corys. Any sand-like material on top will just sift down naturally or get rooted in by the corys. I'm not convinced there's any benefit to plants from Eco-Complete or Flourite, either.

I had Flourite in a 70g tank for two years, and I didn't see any difference in plant growth compared to my fine gravel and sand tanks. Both Flourite and Eco-Complete are too rough for substrate fish - my corys got mouth damage and had to be removed, but they recovered well over play sand.

I still needed to use substrate fertilizers and liquid fertilizers with Flourite, just like I do with my other tanks. I genuinely didn't see any benefits, and the cost was a big factor - $180 compared to $14 for play sand.

Your plants might just have a nutrient deficiency. Liquid fertilizers are easy to add, and we could probably figure out what's going on with more info on your setup - lighting, fertilizers, plant species, and all that.

By the way, I'd listen to Bryan - he helped me with my 20Gal tank plants that were dying. He suggested a zooMed 6500 Fluorescent light, and now my plants are thriving.

I'm going to have to advise against using Eco-Complete, it's just too harsh for corys. And honestly, adding a sand-like material on top isn't going to solve the issue, it'll just sift down or get rooted through by the corys.

From my own experience with Flourite, I can tell you that it didn't provide any noticeable benefits for plant growth in my 70g tank. In fact, I had to remove my corys due to mouth damage from the substrate, but they recovered well once I switched to play sand.

As for you, I'd recommend avoiding Flourite and similar products altogether. If you're looking for a good substrate for your future aquascapes and planted tanks, I'd suggest sticking with something like play sand or fine gravel. It's gentle on substrate fish and works just as well for plant growth.

In your case, since you're not ready to restart your tank, using root tabs is a good idea. But if you're planning to set up new tanks in the future, I'd definitely recommend exploring other substrate options.

For a corie tank, I'd recommend play sand - it's affordable and works great for them. I've got a 20Gal planted corie and shrimp tank, and I use play sand in that one too. The plants are thriving, thanks to the ZooMed 6500K light I've got.

You don't necessarily need a special substrate for planted tanks, but some people like 'em for the color. Me, I'm happy with play sand. My cories and shrimp are doing well, and they help clean up dead plant matter, which is a bonus. Some other critters, like snails and plecos, can help with that too.

I've mentioned this before, but I think a 6500K light is the way to go for plants. 9000K is the max I'd use, but 6500K works wonders.

I've got a similar concern. I'm interested in keeping cories, and I'm currently using Seachem. I'm not too worried about not getting the cories just yet, but I do plan on setting up some aquascapes and planted tanks this summer using tanks I'll find at garage sales. What would you recommend for substrate in those tanks? I agree that Flourite doesn't seem to promote plant growth in my tank, but restarting the tank isn't an option for me right now, so I'll just stick with root tabs.

As for me, I wouldn't keep corys or any substrate-interactive fish over Flourite or Eco-Complete. I chose Flourite initially because it seemed less rough than Eco-Complete when I held it in my hand. That was a mistake. Within a few weeks, my corys had no barbels, torn skin around their mouths, and one panda even lost part of its jaw. I moved them to a tank with play sand, and they've recovered. The panda that lost part of its jaw still looks a bit comical, but it's been able to eat and its barbels have grown a bit over the past four years.

I didn't notice any benefits from using Flourite or Eco-Complete. I've never tried other enriched or plant substrates like ADA, so I won't judge them based on my experience with Flourite and Eco-Complete. However, I've found that plants will grow in any substrate as long as the grains aren't too large. I've had success with fine gravel and sand, and even pea gravel worked, although finer grains seem to work better for plants. You can always use substrate tab fertilizers for larger plants and liquid fertilizers. Allowing organics to accumulate in the substrate will provide nutrients and more CO2 as bacteria break down the organics. I rarely disturb my substrates.

If you plan on keeping fish in your planted tanks, I think it's best to stick with substrates that are safe for them. If you're not planning on keeping fish and just want to create an aquatic garden, you can experiment with different soils and substrates. However, I wouldn't recommend using these substrates with fish unless you have experience with them. Soils, for example, can cause high ammonia levels for up to six months, and many soil-substrate manufacturers recommend not adding fish for several months due to this and other related issues.

Regarding sand and corys, I think it's worth noting that sand is the most natural substrate for them. Play sand is a good option, and it's relatively inexpensive. Corys can survive in fine gravel or smooth pea gravel, but they won't be able to function as naturally as they would in sand. They're designed to sift sand through their barbels as they dig around in their natural habitats, and I think it's our responsibility as aquarium keepers to provide them with the best possible environment.

Thanks for all your responses.

I'll try and give a bit more info about my current set-up, in case there's another cause for the problems I'm having.

My tank is 150L, been set up for just over a year now. I've got 2 x 30 watt T8 bulbs, one 7500K and one more pink one that's designed for plants, but I'm not sure what its K value is. I've also got JBL Kugeln 7+13 balls in the substrate for all my plants, and I dose with Flourish Comprehensive once a week after water change. No CO2. My plants are all low-medium light plants. I've also got a 1200L p/h filter with surface agitation along the length of the tank.

A lot of my plants seem to lose leaves and rot near the bottom, while still showing new growth at the top, although it's not a lot. The roots are often looking a bit rotten when I pull them out, and there's not many to each plant. The fact that the issues are all at the bottom of the plant is what made me think there might be something in the substrate causing the problems.

About 6 months ago, I had to do a bacteria/fungal treatment of the entire tank with a methyl blue based medication. This seemed to be the start of the demise of my plants, and from then on, the ones that were there at the time died off and all new plants added seem to start dying within a month. I'm wondering if there's residue left in the current sand that the plants aren't liking?

The sand is a light silica sand. I'm not sure if we can get suitable "play sand" here, I've never heard of it.

I was thinking of using JBL Manado, it's like a small, rounded, very light & porous gravel made of 100% red scoria. It's got no nutrients added, but it's designed to hold nutrients as well as beneficial bacteria and be easy for plants to spread roots through. It's small and light enough that my corys could easily move it around and sift through it without damaging their sensitive barbels, but it's not quite the same effect as sand. Do you guys think it's a happy safe medium for them? I've got 6 Julii Cory, and I've had them for just over a year now, and they're going well.

Another thought's just occurred to me - how long do those lights actually last? Mine are probably a year old now, so could they be past their prime and due for replacement?

Tank is 150L, been set up for just over a year now. Has 2 x 30 watt T8 bulbs, one 7500K and one more pink one that I can't find it's K value but designed for plants. There are JBL Kugeln 7+13 balls in the substrate for all plants, and I dose with Flourish Comprehensive once a week after water change. No CO2. Plants are all low-medium light plants. 1200L p/h filter with surface agitation along the length of the tank.